Hannah Einbinder stars as Ava with Jean Smart at Debra Vance in “Hacks.”
Courtesy: HBO Max.
This season on Hacks, after working together to strengthen her stand-up act for the past few years, Deborah and writer Ava Daniels have finally reached Deborah’s long held goal of hosting her own talk show.
Now, they just have to find a way to work together to get the show off the ground.
Along with Smart, the cast includes Hannah Einbinder as Ava, with Paul W. Downs as Deborah’s agent, Jimmy, and Megan Statler, as Jimmy’s business partner, Kayla. Downs is also a writer and executive producer on the series along with Jen Statsky, and Lucia Aniello, who also directs several episodes this season.
Forbes‘Mid-Century Modern’ Is Familiar, But Not ‘Your Parents’ Sit-Com,’ Say CreatorsBy Anne EastonDowns explains the decision to finally give Deborah the thing that she’s always wanted, saying, “We have been building this for a long time. We always knew we wanted Deborah to get her white whale [which is]
this late-night show, but we’ve always said that this is a show about the ‘wig-off’ moments. You know, the behind-the-curtain moments. There is a lot behind the scenes drama and comedy that happens at a late-night show, so it was really fun to explore that.”
However, as Smart says of Deborah taking this huge step, “You know, definitely be careful what you wish for. I mean, the pressure, gets to her. Definitely.”
As for Ava, at the conclusion of the previous season, she’d blackmailed her way into the Head Writer job on Deborah’s show, much to Deborah’s dismay because the comedian felt that Ava was a bit too green to handle the position. The friction between the two about this escalates to hilarious levels in the new season.
Of the relationship, Smart says, “It continually amazes me that [the writers] are able to find more and more for us and keep this dynamic going, because I think that’s a lot of the fun for the audience, because that was my biggest fear after the first season, was [I was thinking], ’well now that [Deborah and Ava are] kind of friendly and working together, is that going to be as much fun for the audience to see them butting heads? But it’s amazing to me that it continues it just gets better and better… and meaner and nastier.”
As for Ava’s actions, Einbinder says, “A lot of people ask me like, ‘has Ava turned bad?’ No, I think she still retains that spirit but just kind of has to play ball [with Deborah]
.”
She adds that when she has to tussle with Smart that, “It’s been really cool to get to play the adversarial thing. When we have to fight, [the director] calls cut and we’re just [start hugging and saying], ‘I’m sorry.’ But it is fun to traverse this windy road with the two of them.”
LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA – SEPTEMBER 15: (L-R) Jen Statsky, Paul W. Downs, and Lucia Aniello, winners … More of the Outstanding Comedy Series award and Outstanding Writing for a Comedy Series award for “Hacks” pose in the press room during the 76th Primetime Emmy Awards at Peacock Theater on September 15, 2024 in Los Angeles, California. (Photo by Frazer Harrison/Getty Images)
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Aniello points out that, “It was a fun, fresh challenge to be able to write [Deborah and Ava] in an office setting, so whether they’re arguing about coffee makers or about HR or hiring, it just feels fun to put them in that scenario because the rest of the world knows more [about working in an office] than potentially some comedians. It just felt fresh place in addition to the actual getting a show off the ground.”
“I’ve always found it a little bit insulting that people have this idea that women can’t get along, and that men do. I’ve found that strange,” says Smart of her thoughts about the interaction between Deborah and Ava.
Reminiscing, she recalls, “A million years ago when I was [playing Charlene on] Designing Women, people used to ask us constantly, ‘Wow. What’s it like on the set with four women?” Oh, boy, that must be. Ohhhh.’ We’d sort of think, ‘what?’ I said, ‘do you guys ask the Barney Miller cast that question?’ I mean, I find that really bizarre.”
With her extensive work history, and because she’s starring in Hacks in her ‘70s, Smart says that, “I feel like I don’t want to be like the poster child for older actresses, but certainly, it’s nice to be able to play a character where you show that people have the same kinds of hopes and dreams and desires and everything that they do when they’re 30. So, for people to be able to see that and get used to that because it’s not something we used to see in film and television, and if our show has helped with that a little bit, then bravo.”
Aniello jumps in to say, “You know, older people are cool and funny and sexy and all these things, and I do think Jean has contributed to the reframing of that narrative in that [she’s] ‘hotter than I’ve ever been’ which is a quote from the show, and I think that’s true.”
As for how all of this talk about age influences the series, Statsky says that, “This season in particular is about going after your dream and getting your dream, and I think we do a great disservice to us all as human beings when we put media out there that says that you can only go after your dreams to a certain age. That’s so sad. And we should reflect a world where you don’t have to stop trying.”
Downs says that, “I feel like [this show] is an exercise in empathy, which I think we all need more of, especially today — to be able to see characters that are unlike you, and I think that’s true also of not just older people, but also women and queer people. We want to center stories that haven’t been told and that is central to what the show is about ,and hopefully why it resonates with people.”
While exploring all of this in Hacks, Smart says that everyone experiences both tragedy and comedy every day, surmising, “I mean, that’s just what life is. The tone of [this show is] essentially fun and joyous, but then the reality of that is — there’s always the flip side of the coin.”
And hopefully, Deborah can keep those coyotes at bay, indefinitely.
Season four of ‘Hacks’ premieres on HBO Max on Thursday, April 10th at 9pm e/p, and is available for streaming on the Max app.
